Atheists are people who say there is no God. I mean, that is what they say! But it doesn’t mean their position is correct.
It couldn’t be, because we know better: God exists. But do you know what, it doesn’t really matter; whether people believe that God exists or not, it does not invalidate who He is.
Be an atheist if you want. Remain one if you have been. But know that it is in your better interest to believe in God than to believe that He doesn’t even exist.
For the records. God is God all by Himself, and He will continue to be God all by Himself till eternity.
Neither you who do not believe in God nor I who does believe in Him have anything to add to who God is. He is the all-sufficient One.
I believe in God at my own risk. You disbelief in Him at your own risk as well. So what’s all this argument about whether God exists or not?
I am convinced that God exists and I try to live my life to please Him. So it is understandable if I am filled with God-consciousness every time. In fact that is what is expected from me.
How about you? It should be a different thing all together, but it isn’t.
You are convinced God doesn’t exist. Right? Why then don’t you get on with your life and forget about all this diatribe on the notion of God’s existence? Can you do you that? May be, you can’t after all!
Honestly, I don’t even understand you! Why do you get yourself so worked-up trying to prove that the non-existent God does not exist? It doesn’t sound logical… Are you even sure of what you claim?
I say that God exists, you get displeased. Why? Should you be annoyed about Someone who is non-existent?
You have said with your own mouth that God doesn’t exist yet all your discussions and writings are not complete except there is a reference to God. Why should you be bothered so much to talk about God if you truly believe He doesn’t exist?
Somehow, I believe that even though you call yourself an atheist, you know in your innermost heart that God exists, but you just don’t want to acknowledge it. As usual, you will deny that you know… But I am hardly surprised.
May be we should settle it this way: I believe in God through Jesus Christ, leave me to enjoy the benefits of it here on earth and in the world to come. You deny that God exists, feel free to savour the ‘benefits’ of that here on earth and in the world to come.
One day, both of us, individually, will stand before the God whom you deny…
Are you all right with that? So continue to be an atheist if you want. Don’t give it up!
Did I just say that you can remain in your atheism? Oh please pardon me! What I really mean is for you to come out from atheism to God and out of foolishness into truth.
- Foolishness, because atheism is foolishness. According to the Bible, only a fool can say that God doesn’t exist. (Psalm 14:1; 53:1). It is deception to think that it is wisdom to deny the existence of God.
- Truth, because God exists and it is something you will get to acknowledge one day – either willingly on your own while you are still alive on earth or by default (force) after the breath of life is gone from you. By then, it would have been too late.
For those who arrogantly declare that God does not exist and rail against any mention of His Name, the Scriptures declare all people everywhere will one day confess that indeed there is a God… Until then, we must understand that all men—atheist, agnostic, secularist, humanist, moral and immoral, educated and uneducated—are under God’s judgment apart from saving faith in Christ… Billy Graham
Perhaps I should say this as a parting shot:
The God that you say doesn’t exist loves you unconditionally. All He wants from you is a relationship with Him by faith through His Son Jesus Christ.
What do you say?
©Copyright 2017| Victor Uyanwanne
Victors Corner Blog 
Interesting, yet somewhat familiar all the same.
Based upon what verifiable evidence do you arrive at your view that Yahweh exists? Can you be specific, please.
It would be a measure of honesty and integrity if you are going to claim evidence that you did not cite faith.
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No more rabbit trails please. I believe the substance of the post is clear enough.
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No Rabbit Trail, Victor, simply an attempt for us to enter into honest dialogue without falling back onto presupposition.
If you have evidence then please, let’s talk about it.
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This is a good post, Victor. Atheism is a dark and twisted way for Satan to turn people away from God.
One of my fellow WordPress bloggers SpaniardVIII actually has a whole category dedicated to Atheism and its affects. If you want to check it out, the link is below:
https://spiritualminefield.wordpress.com/category/atheism/
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I appreciate your comments. Yes, as the Bible points out, atheism is foolishness. If only they would realise it.
I have discovered SpaniardVIII only in the last few hours and we have been interacting with each other since then. I enjoyed reading his posts. Thanks for the recommendation.
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It was not a problem. I actually follow his blog because he talks about topics that even I am uncomfortable talking about.
His topic on Atheism is really good becuase we get to discuss in depth about this topic. He and I even go back and forth with other non-believers.
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That’s all right. Now that I have discovered his blog, I will be sure to read it often and engage as well.
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Jesus Never Existed, After All
By Nigel Barber
In an earlier post, I argued that the historicity of Jesus was doubtful. Some religion scholars questioned one of my sources. Now, recent scholarship comes as close as possible to settling the issue.
Personally, I have no ax to grind so far as the historical existence of Jesus is concerned. If anything, I would prefer to believe that the life of Jesus, painstakingly learned in childhood, was connected to history rather than a fiction.
Unfortunately, much of what one reads on this question is biased whether by religion scholars, and religious believers, who promote the historical Jesus, or atheist writers intent on debunking him.
Richard Carrier’s 600-page, note-filled tome, On the Historicity of Jesus belongs in the second camp but it poses a challenge that academic proponents of the historical Jesus seem unlikely to overcome.
Jesus as a No-Show in History
There are many technical issues that historians must grapple with in determining whether some personage is historical, or fictitious. One is whether the Biblical gospels can be regarded as historical sources.
In general, historians discount written sources that were committed to paper more than a century after the events they describe. Moreover, they prefer the authorship to be clearly established and for the writer to have a direct connection to what is recorded.
The Biblical gospels do not cut it as history in these terms. Only St. Paul is thought to qualify in chronological terms. Yet, Paul had almost nothing to say about Jesus as a man and seems to have conceptualized him as a rarefied celestial being.
For these reasons, most of the weight falls on Roman scholars and historians. Of these, Josephus, and Tacitus are most often cited as providing good documentary evidence for a historical Jesus. Carrier dismisses the two relevant Josephus passages as interpolations, or pieces added in to the manuscript by Christian scribes.
One passage refers to the execution of Jesus by Pilate (called the Testimonium Flavianum). Carrier (p. 332) comments, “This passage is self-evidently a fawning and gullible Christian fabrication, in fact demonstrably derived from the Emmaus narrative in the Gospel of Luke, inserted into the text at a point where it does not make any narrative sense …”
Carrier (pp. 337-8) argues that the second Josephus passage referring to James the brother of Jesus actually referred to James the brother of Jesus ben Damneus who was falsely executed by the high priest Ananus who was removed from office as a punishment and replaced by the same Jesus ben Damneus, He concludes that the phrase “(who was called Christ)” is probably a copyist error.
The Tacitus reference to “Chrestians” evidently refers to a Jewish rebel (Chrestus) who was executed but had nothing to do with Christianity. Carrier (pp. 343-4) concludes that a line referring to Pontius Pilate as the official who executed Christ, “is probably an interpolation, and that Tacitus in fact originally described not the Christians being scapegoated for the fire, [in Rome] but followers of the Jewish instigator Chrestus first suppressed under Claudius…” If Tacitus attributed the fire in Rome to Christians, he was the only Roman historian to do so.
If Jesus cannot be convincingly documented as a historical figure, then where do the New Testament narratives come from? Carrier offers a very detailed working out of the theory that instead of being a historical person, Jesus was a mythical hero analogous to Jason, Hercules, or Oedipus.
Mythical Jesus
The hero-type of a divine king was described by scholars Otto Rank and Lord Raglan who established 22 distinctive features that range from virgin birth to death atop a hill and disappearance of the body.
Jesus has 20 of the 22 features (according to the Gospel of Matthew, 14 according to the Gospel of Mark), compared to 22 for Oedipus, 19 for Dionysus, 17 for Hercules, and 14 for Jason.
No historical person provides a close match with the hero-type so the close match of Jesus with the hero-type means that he could not have been a real historical person. Despite this, each of the heroes was considered to be historical and placed in history in stories written about them.
So the theory of Jesus as a myth neatly explains how Jesus did not exist as a historical person yet was inserted into historical narratives by New Testament authors.
Implications for the Origin of Religions
In my earlier post, I described how Mormonism sprang from the fertile imagination of convicted confidence trickster Joseph Smith. In the course of time, Mormons lost many of their objectionable doctrines, including polygamy, racism, and “celestial marriage” (or church-sanctioned adultery) and grew into a respectable world religion.
I raised the possibility that some world religions begin as deliberate frauds. The Jesus myth provides an altogether different explanation for religious origins. Not all new religions are fictions invented by con men like Joseph Smith. Some are based on longstanding myths that address ancient human psychological needs for order and security.
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Every one and anyone who claims that Jesus never existed in history is either colossally ignorant or deliberately mischievous. Or as the Bible puts it, anyone who denies that Jesus came in the flesh is not of God. Thank you.
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All you’ve made is Pascal’s wager, in which you assume only your version of your god exists. If your argument was valid, then you would be worshipping all of the gods because “what if?” In that you don’t follow your own advice, there must be a reason why.
As for why atheists discuss gods, it is because the behavior of people is influenced by their beliefs and understanding them and pointing out the failure of theistic beliefs helps moderate the damage that is done in the world by the religious. Far too many people allow their children to die because of religion, hate others of different religions/sects and try to harm them because of religion, and try to force their personal hatreds and desires on others because of religion.
As for this god loving “unconditionally”. There are many conditions that this god places on his love. This god demands worship and obedience and constantly threatens punishment and death if it doesn’t get what it wants. Those threats are passed along by its followers, and that can lead to non-believers being murdered. That is not “unconditional” by any definition.
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Paschal’s wager, “…that a rational person should live as though God exists and seek to believe in God,” which you referred is not necessarily wrong in itself but it is definitely not the premise of this post.
It is obvious you don’t understand my perspectives or deliberately chose to miscontrue them. First, I do not believe in multiple gods as you suggested; only God the Creator of the Universe, the Father of Jesus Christ is recognised as the true God.
Secondly, this post is not about religion. So you missed the point again. If you hate religion, I don’t like it too in the context of how it is spoken around the world. What I do know is that knowing the true God involves having a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. To that extent I see Christianity as a RELATIONSHIP, not as a RELIGION as you suggested. This relationship does no harm to any body.
God’s love is unconditional, your disbelief doesn’t change it. God’s standard was for all men to live righteously before Him, but no one could live up to it. But in Christ He now provided the way of escape whereby we have the opportunity of coming to Him in Christ righteousness rather than ours.
It is imperative to follow God but it is not a do or die affair – the individual has to make the choice by his or herself. So you can be sure about this: anyone who tries to force you to accept his beliefs or be killed has not met the true God. When it comes following the true God, you have the choice to, or not to…
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That’s a rather curious claim that your post about religion isn’t about religion, “a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices “. Why would you lie about something like that when your post is all about religion, your believe in the Christian religion and your worship of it, and trying to convince atheists to convert to your religion? And I am not the one who is misreading something. I am asking why you don’t believe in multiple gods if you think one should believe in your god “just in case”.
I do not “hate” religion, but I do ask questions of those who claim that their religion is the one and only true one. As much as you might dislike the term religion, that is what you practice. I can understand why you may not like it because the actions of believers have shown religion to be less than believable and beneficial. A relationship is between two or more beings, not between a person and something that they cannot show exists. A child does not have a relationship with an imaginary friend.
The actions by the religious and those who claim that they have a relationship with a being that cannot be shown to exist have and continue to harm people. Parents allow their children to die because they think that they have some relationship to god so that this god will heal their children. When they die, that shows no relationship and no god at all, or at least not a beneficial loving god.
The god of the bible does not offer unconditional love. The Old Testament is full of conditions, aka this god’s laws of behavior and actions. The New Testament says that all of these laws are in place until the earth and heaven disappear. I haven’t noticed this, have you? The NT also says that anyone who doesn’t believe in this god deserves death and worse. That is not unconditional love: requiring something in exchange for love. That is the action of an abusive authority figure.
I know what the bible says and your misrepresentation of it for your own benefit doesn’t change that.
You seem unaware what imperative means, it means that it is exactly a do or die affair. Imperative means necessary. As for the individual making the choice, you also seem unaware that your bible says that there is no choice involved at all; people may only accept this god if this god allows it (Romans 9). Jesus Christ also says this when he says he intentionally uses parables so some people will never accept him. I’ve read the bible, it seems you have not.
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Darn thing is touchy but you get the drift. The very best you can do is present an argument for the logic of belief that requires faith. You sir will be the very first and will be as famous as Jesus itself.
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Your objectives are hardly specific, full of rabbit trails. It will help for you to say a few things about yourself, what you believe, why you are interested in talking about the God and the Bible you don’t believe in. You got the drift too?
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When I was a kid I lived in the quiet, almost exclusively white, middle class, Mt. Tabor neighborhood in S.E. Portland, Oregon. There were plenty of neighbor kids my age to play with. We had a tree fort, rode bikes, roller skated and did plenty of mischief. It’s a great place to raise a family. Like most kids my age the slings and arrows of the dominant culture had not yet impacted my childish world view. I was blissfully unaware that I and my family were exceptional in any way until the day a new friend introduced me to his mother. I recall standing there expecting a “happy to meet you”, but no, she stood there looking at me contemplatively. She intuitively discerned that my last name was not Anglo-Saxon and an intarigation would surely reveal my hidden shame. Her narrow line of inquiry focused on “what kind of name is that”? With a knowing expression on her fizz, she informed me, in a stern tone’ that my ability to interact with god was dramatically impacted by my fathers heritage and my prayers would go no further than the ceiling. Then, with a note of certainty, proclaimed I was a prime candidate for a one way ticket to hell. She was quite sure about this and my “friend” agreed with credible certainty. Damn. My nine year old self was startled, nervous and confused. Prayer? Hell? What did that have to do with Graham playing at my house? Prayer? What brought this on and how could his mom confront me like that? Never mind that religion was rarely, if ever, discussed in our home. Things like wishes I was familiar with. Prayer, not so much. If I wished for something and told mom or dad I had a reasonable chance for a positive outcome. If I didn’t the odds for success were nil. When I had a problem, issue or question that was beyond me and those were legion; I was a kid after all. I had parents, teachers, relatives and friends to help should I need it. My mom tried explaining religious intolerance but being a youngster I had no experience with prejudice and failed to see how it could apply to me. I think I was more confused than enlightened. Where did my friend and his mom’s antipathy towards me and mine come from? To my ear the tone of her declarations were accusatory. These concepts were not part of my prepubescent paradigm. No, this was a conundrum that I needed to work through and to this day I credit the experience for being the vaccine that inoculated me against unfounded claims to knowledge. Today, I’m simultaneously amused and incredulous by people’s propensity to embrace avenues to truth that rely on faith. Faith is the descriptor people use to justify their conclusions on the validity of a claim on insufficient, poor or no evidence at all. Put another way, the only mechanism we have to evaluate the validity of any claim is to use an evidentiary approach to knowledge.
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Your experience with your friend and his mum are regrettable. So unfortunate they had limited knowledge about what being a follower of Jesus Christ is. Otherwise they would have acted better than they did towards you.
I’m not judging them but I believe even you could see that they have not represented God well by their attitude towards you. My point is: don’t judge all Christians by the behaviour of your friend and her mum.
The objections you raised about faith are not valid at all. Well, I don’t blame you for that because you would never thoroughly understand the issues of faith and prayer being an outsider; you have to be in Christ to truly appreciate how they work.
Any body that relates with God from the perspective of religion will always get it wrong. Without a relationship with God through Jesus Christ, religion profits nothing. If you have not found God, that doesn’t mean he doesn’t exist.
Faith does not underplay knowledge. In Christianity, knowledge has its place. Faith has its proper place as well. So any presupposition that faith is against knowledge is misplaced.
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Boy, you just don’t get it. What you believe is real is delusional. You can reference your book all you want but it was not written by a god. It was written by Jewish men. These guys were repeatedly, over millennia, punching up their stories in earnest after EACH of there conquest by a dominant cultural. This is why the text reflects the beliefs of their conquerers. Writings of various extinct Jewish sects turn up with regularity all over the region. The book you refer to as the inerrant word of god is clearly in error about almost everything including it moral pronouncements. Think about it. Why aren’t you a practicing Muslim or Jew or what ever. I’ll bet you dollars to donuts you spend years of making perfect sense of the senseless. This is very difficult, especially if you come from a religious background and believe with certainty what you’ve been taught from the time you could talk. Come at the subject as if a god is a new concept. Oh, one more thing, if there were no god, what would the world be like today?
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There would be no world today if there was no God! The world was created by God.
Only fools believe there is no God. The one that is delusional is the one that believes God doesn’t exist. And that’s not me.
Your incorrect comments on the Bible does not invalidate it as the word of God written by men as inspired by the Holy Spirit.
You won’t understand it because its truths are beyond your ordinary sense knowledge comprehension. Whatever you say that fails to acknowledge God and the divine inspiration of the Bible is misguided.
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And why do you think that.
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I have shared many thoughts with you already. I need to be sure which of them your question referred to before I can offer an appropriate response.
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There is no way to investigate claims of the supernatural. All religions make claims about our natural world that are in direct conflict with what is testable and verifiable. The fact that religious adherents can ignore this suggests something akin to a mental conundrum separating what is and isn’t real. Abrahamic religions are based on Iron Age world views. All religious texts were undisputedly written by men. This is why the books are not the perfect words of anything. Food for thought for sure but what about morality? Biblical morality is based on a series of pronouncements that mix edicts and commands reflecting the imagination of the men who wrote them. With little effort a senior high school ethics project could do better. And yet, billions of people view of their world is framed by beliefs based on those same books. To be generous Christianity, Judaism and Islam are all deeply flawed primitive attempts to explain our world and our place in it. More likely these are fanatical cults that flourished. Of the three Islam stands out. It’s the books. Worse than the Old Testament and that’s some creepy shit. Too much? Over the top? I think not. Beliefs do have consequences and the belief in jehad, martyrdom and paradise are a death cocktail liberally employed by terrorists who identify as Muslim almost daily. This is an undeniable fact. Muslim Zealots proudly admit to the carnage and have a fully justifiable expectation that fellow adherents will emulate their actions. Ja, dur da goot guys. Their doing Gods work. How do they know this? It’s legitimized in their holy books. The Muslim fundamentalists are not the problem. The problem is the fundamentals of Islam. They are assured by their Imams and fellows that it is what God expects of them and they will be rewarded amply in whatever imagined afterlife they have in their heads. The rest of humanity are infidels and have it coming. No joke, look it up. There is a profound reluctance, a taboo if you will, to criticize religion. Especially Islam. The Muslim activist, Maajid Nawaz, described this reluctance as the Voldemort or “he who must not be named” syndrome. This level of turpitude is unmatched in modern versions of Theistic beliefs. It is religions version of living in North Korea. No criticism of Islam by anybody shall be allowed. Maybe you don’t feel threatened by religion. Then tell me why you show up to any international airport 2 hours prior to departure. Could it be you just woke up one day and decided your travel experience would be enhanced by being body scanned and having your shampoo confiscated. No! There’s a group of us that doesn’t seem to play well with others and hasn’t for 1,400 years. It is unfortunate but it wouldn’t hurt to familiarize yourself with the tenants of a faith that fosters the behaviors of Islamists in the world today. There is a decided lack of respect for non Muslims by Islam. If you’re not Muslim, you are by definition inferior to all Muslims and an Infidel. It’s in da book. There is polling data available regarding Muslim attitudes regarding the killing of non combatants in defense of the faith and the percentages of the faithful who believe that the penalty for apostasy, blasphemy, adultery or homosexuality should be as prescribed; death. Keep in mind that most Islamic countries will not allow these polling questions. What your left to sample are mainly Muslims in western countries. If their responses don’t make you suck air and grab your privates you need to take a moral gut check. What the hell, here goes. [There were 2861 Islamic attacks in 53 countries in which 27616 people were killed and 26143 injured in 2015. In a 30 day period from May 18th to June 17th 2016, there were 212 Islamic attacks in 31 countries, in which 2160 people were killed and 1895 injured. Referenced Wikipedia.] Now, here’s the interesting part. This data doesn’t surprise you at all. A religion of peace? Nonsense. It’s always safe to ask (WWMD) what would Mohammed (pbuh) do? Every Medieval, irrational, abhorrent, violent action a Muslim adherent commits is literally codified in their sacred books authored and/or modeled by Mo himself. The Quran and the Hadith, when viewed through Islamic filters, are crystal clear-ish on all issues that define what it is to be human. No ifs. No ands. No buts. Apparently Allah is a monoglot because to really understand the Quran you need to understand Arabic. Oh ya, here’s an interesting aside. When dealing with infidels (this means you) lying and deceit are not sins. Whatever gets the job done. More than a few Muslims seem determined to bring about a return to a 7th century world. How is a person to know what to think. Governments tell us its not Islam only Islamic extremists are to blame. Really, you’d have to be in total isolation for the past 40yrs. to have missed the connection. You may have noticed, it’s in your face daily. These folks are as serious as a heart attack and they’re telling anyone who’ll listen what’s motivating them to behave the way they do and what they have planned for everyone’s future. On a daily basis, in Muslim communities everywhere, there are HONOR KILLINGS OF WOMEN, ACID ATTACKS ON WOMEN AND FEMALE GENITAL MUTILATION. If the macabre is your thing there are PUBLIC BEHEADINGS (INCLUDING IN MECCA for Christ’s sake), PUBLIC FLOGGINGS, SUICIDE BOMBINGS, MURDERS OF ATHEISTS, APOSTATES AND BLASPHEMERS. VIOLENCE OPENLY PREACHED AT MOSQUES AGAINST ANY MUSLIM WHO QUESTIONS ANY OF THESE ATROCITIES. This is nothing short of barbarism. If any of these behaviors were happening anywhere else on Earth, by any other group of people, the outcry would be defining. Our conundrum is that to criticize any religion is taboo. To criticize it from within can result in your imprisonment or worse, your death. Granted, Christian precepts and practices frequently conflict with efforts to prevent the spread of diseases, prevent unintended pregnancies and contributes to sectarianism world wide. It promotes the persecution of LGBT peoples, rejects medical science in favor of their holy books and promotes views that women are inferior and are required to be subservient to men. Just don’t rock the boat, one must never question nor criticize these faiths. Religion is not benign. Christianity, Judaism, Islam indeed all religions are man made constructs but Islam is lethal and ascending. There, I said it. Why don’t I feel better? Apparently none of this moves the needle for many people. Consider this. Arguably the followers of Islam are amongst the most devout religious peoples on earth. Their faith defines their lives and culture. Muslim leaders have not been receptive to notions that they may want to modify their doctrine so it might approximate 21st Centuries morals, culture, democratic and legal norms. Islam is in direct conflict with western notions of human rights and jurisprudence. Yes, there are many none observant Muslims in the world. Unfortunately, there might not be a moderate path if you are “just” an “observant” Muslim. Moderate? Most Muslims will have no concept of what you’re talking about. Moderate forsooth. Again, this can’t be emphasized enough, their operating under the belief their interpreting “the perfect word of God” yada, yada. Oh, there are moderate Muslims, of a sort, and they can be found in their thousands in prisons throughout the Muslim world. There are upwards of fifty countries where sharia law applies impart or in full to Muslims and a few where it applies to everyone. A few Western democracies allow for Sharia law as a parallel legal system. You do remember that the Quran is the perfect word of God. Observe what’s happening with the mass migration, caused by religious/sectarian conflicts, to the secular countries of Europe. Tensions over feelings of being invaded by people’s holding world views that are in direct conflict with their own. The overwhelming majority of migrants are practicing Muslims. A very small number of whom will randomly explode. Understandably the good people of Europe feel under appreciated and ill used. Their guests may rejoice in their rescue but they arrive with an uncompromising certainty that their hosts are infidels whose legal and political systems lack a certain theistic enfaces. It’s all in the book, Aka. “the perfect word of God”. This does not bode well for Western Civilization. Political correct me all you like. I do not know a single human that is a practicing Muslim. I have no reason to think them to be anything other than normal people’s who believe things on extremely bad to no evidence. The same thing can be said about Christian faith healers and the Christian Scientist Sect. There are few Western educated people who think deeply held beliefs are the ultimate in health care and would never think it acceptable to label a person phobic for suggesting that this practice is dangerous in the extreme. This accusatory attitude is being fueled by a political correctness gone amuck. It is akin to the persecution of whistle blowers and the military’s reactions to sexual misconduct charges by women. We do not have a universal understanding of human rights. The West has much to atone for. Judaea Christians believe in objective values gleaned from their God book. Not appreciably different from the source of Islamic values. What I find particularly disturbing is that anyone would favor primitive Iron Age standards on ethics and morales. My extremely limited understanding of Islam is that it is a theology, legal and political construct. Christianity went through the Enlightenment and Judaism, who’s books could have been authored by Lucifer himself, had the Haskalah (Jewish enlightenment). They no longer conflate the three. Islam on the other hand is still driving the same chariot it rode in on. The most devout Christian or Jew I know goes to church or synagogue a few days a week and maybe participates in discussion groups now and again. None of them spend any energy debating how to effectively deal with the infidels they’re forced to coexist with. Their holy books say some vary disparaging things about Christians, Jews and Sigma Nu’s. Putting people to the sword was and is a popular option. According to the Quran, Islam will inexorably absorb as many of you as possible then subjugate the rest. Oh yes, while you were protecting the unborn, lobbying for prayer in public schools, planting God in the science curriculum and dictating who can marry whom, due to migration most of Europe will be majority Muslim in approximately one and a half generations. Breath taking ain’t it? Here’s an interesting factoid. The fine folks at the United Nations, in April of 1999, at the urging of the Organization of the Islamic Conference (OIC), Pakistan brought before the United Nations Commission on Human Rights a resolution entitled “Defamation of Islam”. The purpose of the resolution was to have the Commission stand up against what the OIC claimed was a campaign to defame Islam. It passed! Our UN ambassador said something to the effect that we’re not going to weaken our right to free speech. Not in the U.S. of A. Don’t get too smug. Our “religious right” supports anti defamation laws. Apparently theocratic government is the Religious rights ideal. Western democracies have been trying to un-shoot their feet every since. You may also be interested in learning the number of people who have been tortured, imprisoned and executed under laws codified under the resolution. I highly recommend further inquiry. Should you be a “live and let live” person who thinks people are mostly the same the world over, a rethink may be in order. You’re behaving like the proverbial Frog being cooked in slowly heating water. The fastest growing religion on the planet may tolerate your world view, for now, but their book has other plans for you and yours. Ain’t religion just the best human construct ever? It fosters an environment for rational people to believe in claims to knowledge they have no verifiable evidence for. None! The single evidentiary source of said knowledge is a book of ideas that were conceptualized by a Iron Age culture that included monotheistic sect to signify the validity of their social strata. The best part is they didn’t know that the earth wasn’t the center of the known universe, the planet is round not flat and ¾ of Earth was totally unknown to them. This whole rant has been self indulgent and in the end, to miss quote Fox Mulder, people “want to believe” the unbelievable and apparently facts and reason have little to no sway over faith. 1 TheReligionofPeace.com
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I would appreciate if you would just express your own views rather than advancing the rantings of someone who clearly lacks understanding of what he stands here criticising. The writer’s position about Christianity is obviously flawed. Whoever believes him has fallen into deception, with grave consequence.
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WHY I GIVE A THOUGHT TO WHAT YOU AND ALL THIEST BELIEVE.
The majority of the worlds population believe in Gods, Deities, Devils, eternal afterlife, prayer, miracles and angles on no credible evidence. NONE AT ALL! It truly is an amazing time to be alive. New discoveries seemingly happen daily. Each one adding to our understanding of the natural world. For example, the rock we live on is vary old. At some point in our distant past a convergence of elements and conditions combined to foster life on our planet. We aren’t sure how this happened but it did. It must have been like Goldie Locks’s stolen porridge, just right. Anyway, once it started, Earth seems to be something of a perpetual motion, organic life, machine. All this was happening over hundreds of millions of years. We, Homo Sapiens, are a product of those conditions. Earth is figuratively our “mother” but she takes no interest in our survival. Indeed, somewhere in the neighborhood of 99% of all species that have ever existed on Earth are extinct. GONE! Only their fossils remain. Our species is a relative newcomer to the party. About 200,000 years ago our species differentiated from other primates and began to exhibit evidence of behavioral modernity around 50,000 years ago. (Behavioral modernity is a suite of behavioral and cognitive traits that distinguishes current Homo sapiens from anatomically modern humans, hominids, and other primates. The consensus is that modern human behavior can be characterized by abstract thinking, planning depth, symbolic behavior (e.g. art, ornamentation, music), exploitation of large game, and blade technology, among others (cut and pasted from Wikipedia)). So, how are these fabulous attributes working for us so far? Well, if nature holds true, there won’t be another sentient being to evolve and note our passing. There is no disputing that humans have treated our planet as a birth right to use in any way we want. And why not? A different mined set a different paradigm. Today we can investigate our natural world like never before. We have the ability to reliably predict our future. We also display questionable judgment. It will be touch and go until the bitter end. No matter what we do, eventually the Sun will swell to engulf the earth. Here’s the deal; until that happens, if we do not modify our thinking regarding our relationship with our own kind (news flash: We are all the same species not races) and the other life forms on the planet we will surely accelerate our extinction. As a species the end may be inevitable. Doesn’t it make good sense to maximize our survival for as long as possible? Our minds are either going to be the vehicle for survival or a form of genocide. With the majority of humanity still holding to primitive notions of our natural world, codes of behavior, gender roles, political constructs, environmental health, animal husbandry, conflict resolutions, crime, punishment and the existence of the supernatural, we will have a nearly impossible task of improving our chance for long term survival. Isn’t it obvious. Tribalism, theology/sectarianism and the notion of nation states are antithetical to our species survival. These concepts need to be relegated to the scrap heap of history. It is the fear of the unknown that prevents people from even a fleeting glimpse of reality when it comes to their beliefs. The number of religions that have ever existed is unknown and unknowable. According to the people who keep tract of these things there are more than 700 established Religions in the world today. They can be further branched out into up to 4000 distinct sects. This presumes they are all false but the one you believe in if you are a Theist. Do most faiths have a God that only communicates through one person at a time? A person that was solely selected for that purpose? Ya betcha. Covert in the extreme don’t you think. What you believe is largely determined by the dominate culture of your birth place. It is true that people experience both conversion and de-conversion later in life but that is clearly the exceptions to the norm. I mean, “when you’re a Jet, you’re a Jet all the way”. Interestingly the major religions claim that their God decided to communicate with humanity through it’s magical intermediary to a select individual. These individuals supposedly recorded the dictated messages and were compelled to enlighten their peeps. The glaring exception is Christianity whose books were written decades after their messenger died and therefore are technically hearsay and not on the seen reporting. This form of communication has presented us with a problem. It seems that god is a less than ordinary communicator. People have been left to interpret their gods messages. The result is a mess of conflicting world views. Really? A God. Without exception, all the worlds religions have nothing coherent to say about our natural world. Nothing! How the universe was formed. It’s age. The age of our planet. The physical nature of the universe. Where we are in the universe. How and when life evolved on Earth. As a result adherents must suspend with reason or evidence and accept claims of the supernatural on faith because evidence for these claims does not exist. Oh ya, sourcing holy books as evidence ain’t evidence. Now let us get to the foundational bedrock of the three Abrahamic religions. Morality. In their Gods own voice come pronouncements that would shame a psychopath. I can smell the brimstone. Slavery, mass murder, filicide, genocide, rape, pedophilia, sexism and sex organ mutilation. Entire populations of people have been scapegoated, demonized, ostracized or marginalized. The faithful are given their marching orders. God declaring that blasphemy, apostasy, adultery, homosexuality, imaginary attributes like witchcraft and other behaviors shall require you to kill the person. These are the easy picks. Make no mistakes, I am being judgmental and I am profoundly disappointed in humanities blind spots. Objective morality coming from Religious pronouncements and the notion of free will are demonstrably wrong. It is our mortality and the promise of life after death that accounts for this blind spot to reason. We are communal animals. Our ability to cooperate for mutual benefit and trust form our foundation for morality. A morality that is based on evidence and is adaptable to new information about your physical world. Examples of this occur frequently, such as, our thinking on the subjects of segregation, slavery, gender equity, sexual identity and on and on. In a reason and knowledge based society nothing is grander than to learn you have been wrong and get the opportunity to learn. The survival of any species depends on it’s members mutual cooperation. We are hard wired by our genetics to have visceral responses to visual, auditory and tactual stimuli. We share common responses to fight or flight. We know to avoid things that cause pain or worse. We enjoy things that bring pleasure. These attributes and the needs of the group to prosper are the origins of a natural organic moral code. We are capable of teaching our children concepts of right and wrong, how to work cooperatively with others, compassion and charity….. We need not be rigidly attached to any dogma. Religion is imprisoned by dogma. The worlds religions moral pronouncements are stuck in the era they were founded. They have primitive notions of mans relationship to others and the environment. Most employ terror tactics such as unimaginable suffering in an afterlife, being expelled/ouster-sized, excommunicated and death for apostasy to assure unconditional acceptance of doctrine. Seems fair. The faithful say “well sure there are some bad things in their texts and in their past but there are many good things too”. BFD. A group of ten year olds could to come up with a better codes to live by than the ones in the Bible, Koran or Torah. The books are said to be the words of God and they are clearly and unnervingly pathological. History is replete with groups of people who do inexplicable things in the name of religion. There are examples of Religious groups that participate in mass suicide. Presumably to be with their God. This behavior should be approved of, admired, yes, envied by all people of faith. Ok, this may be a little extreme for most people. The vast majority of people think their faith is a test for entry to their Gods happy place after they die. Wishful thinking, YOU CAN’T CHEAT DEATH! A world view based on evidence and reason alone is disturbing to the people’s of the “book”. I get that and knowing it chills me to the bone. A god that controls the universe and apparently prefers to remain hidden. Really? Not a peep, not a sign, nothing, nada. The only way to know this god is communing with your imagination. Your only access is the reality you create with the guidance of a trained practitioner of a book indisputably written by men 2000 years ago. Wow. We are all together on this journey through time. The natural world is all there is. Magical thinking has been a factor that has accompanied us through our sojourn. We should pay homage to it and move on. To insist on asking WHY the universe is the way it is, is not a question that will move us forward. There’s only one question for us to consider. That question is HOW! We either evolve to plot a future for our survival or slip away into oblivion like all the other hominids that came before us. 🌏🌍🌎 Source: Musing of an anti-theist.
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It is unfortunate how much time some people spend writing about what they neither know nor believe in. I think I have said it before. But for emphasis sake I will say it again: The God I believe in is the true God, the father of the Lord Jesus. To that extent I don’t like being grouped amongst the believers in gods. That’s really offensive.
My own God clearly does not recognise any other god. And I don’t as well! One commandment He gave us says not to have any other god before Him. So it’s grossly mistaken to be talking about the true God along side the so-called other gods in the same breadth.
In the finally analysis, the argument is really not about whether you are an atheist or a theist. But whether you believe in the only true God. That’s what it all boils down to.
While the Bible says atheism is foolishness, it also says being a theist is not enough. Even the devil is a theist! What that means is that believing that God exists is not a enough; there must also be a willing acceptance of the atonement work of Jesus. Without that, there is no other way available.
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Let me get this straight. You’ve got a book and something called revelation or revealed truth. That’s it. If you want to become an atheist go to divinity school and learn what a sausage fest the making of that book entailed. Never mind that there were 30+ Jewish sect in active competition during the first century the earliest Christians believe Jesus be a spirt with a back story much like other deities of the period. The Christ story is freakishly similar to the story of Moses and many other well know allegories and other religions superheroes. One of the best divinity departments in the country is at Chapel Hill, North Carolina. I’ll bet you can audit classes for free. Your satanic friend, Nationofnope.
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Contrary to your suggestion, Many people are atheists without having gone to any divinity school. But if anyone has become an atheist after going there, it shows that person had never experienced the true God.
The stories of Moses and Jesus Christ are far more than those of super heroes and they are not allegories as you put it. Moses was a prophet. Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Sorry, I could never be your ‘satanic friend’ because I am not only a friend of Jesus Christ and I belong to God, spirit, soul and body.
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Oh please, another garden variety Christian. No, no, no. The two narratives are all but identical. Read the damn book.
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In case you are still in doubt, I’m the kind of Christian who believes in the true God as the creator of heaven and earth, who sent His Son Jesus Christ to die for the sins of the world; that anyone who believes in Christ will not perish but will have eternal life. I hope that helps…
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Prove it. Forget the book. It is the simple product of its time. Assertions of divine input are Faust that, assertions. There is absolutely none and there can’t be for the same reasons the Books of Scientology, Mormonism, Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam
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I have nothing to prove to you, neither can I forget the Bible. If you don’t accept its’ authority, that’s left to you. For us as Christians, its’ divine inspiration is not in doubt and we accept it as our life manual. No basis to compare with the other books you mentioned. The Bible is in a class of its own.
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It’s like the quote that says: “If I’m wrong about God then I’ve wasted my life. If you’re wrong about God then you’ve wasted your eternity!”
Great post! Thanks for sharing!
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Leigh, I’m glad you found the post great. Thanks for reading and commenting.
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Leigh, how do you know you have the right god? If you don’t, Pascal’s Wager doesn’t work for you.
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What do I say?
Utter whimsical unfounded arrogant nonsense. You did ask!
Are you basing all that on the big book of contradictions?
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Even though you could have been nicer with your comment, thank you for reading and commenting all the same. I have no doubt something in the post already struck a chord in you.
I do not base my opinions on any book of contradictions. Perhaps you could be clearer with your question.
Anyway, it is no secret that just like with many other followers of the true God, my worldview is largely shaped by the infallible word of God as documented in the Bible.
Did that answer your question?
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You have set a tone here with your aggressive descriptions of atheists.
Anyway, it does answer my question, after a fashion.
I still don’t understand how critics deal with all the contradictions in the bible though. What about the really horrifying passages in the old testament, the ones that describe a malevolent god.
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If you are telling me that you are an atheist, then I would say the post has hit its target audience. I’m happy to hear that my earlier response answered your question…
There is nothing in the Bible that doesn’t have an explanation. What you call contradictions have apparently been misinterpreted or misunderstood. So don’t blame the Book, blame your understanding.
I’m afraid critics will never be able to properly comprehend the Bible. It is not just a book, it is the inspired word of God. So one would need to have the spirit of God in him or her to be able to understand it well.
I hope that’s not too much to take in?
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