Is The Bible Creating Atheists?

How are atheists made? Does the Bible contribute in creating atheists? Instead of revealing God to us, is the Bible now taking people away from God?

I asked those questions not because I don’t believe in the Bible anymore, neither is it because I do not know the purpose of the Bible. But because I want to frontally address a wrong notion a reader has about the Bible and atheism.

One atheist who commented on one of my posts has alleged that “the Bible is the best book for creating atheists.” I would not let that pass just like that because it’s possible there are some other people with that same kind of erroneous thinking.

First and foremost, any Christian worth the name will not dispute the divine inspiration of the Bible, neither will he or she agree with the suggestion that the Bible creates atheists. But in the interest of those who may not be so grounded, further examination may be necessary.

To examine the claim that the Bible is the best book for creating atheists, we would just take a quick look at what purpose the Bible serves.

In his second letter to Timothy, apostle Paul categorically stated the inspiration behind, and the purpose of, the (Bible) Scriptures:

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for instruction, for conviction, for correction, and for training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be complete, fully equipped for every good work (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

From that verse, we can see that the Bible scripture was inspired by God and is “profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness” and “to equip us for every good work.”

Purpose of the Bible

As one source puts it, “The Bible is great literature and the all-time number-one best-seller. It contains history, entertaining stories, poetry, philosophy, and personal letters. But, more than that, the Bible is God’s Word. If we have to speak of a single purpose of the Bible, it would be to reveal God to us. There are many things that we could never know about God unless He told them to us. The Bible is God’s self-revelation to humanity. The Bible also tells us who we are. It tells us of our sin and of God’s plan of salvation in Jesus Christ.”

Despite the reality described above, there are people who have a complete misunderstanding of what the Bible is about. And that’s rather unfortunate.

Recently on this blog, I had an extended interaction with an atheist who read and commented on one of my posts. At some point during the online conversation, the atheist made the following comment about the Bible and God:

The bible has numerous books filled with violence and much of this violence is by your god. It sounds like he has no idea how to be a god of peace. Doesn’t he have an anger management problem, if he exists? No wonder that the bible is the best book for creating atheists. You need to read it properly.

My response to him went as follows:

If you believe that God has an anger issue, it means you are admitting that He exists in the first place. When you are honest about that, we can begin to explore the nature of God, which obviously you have misunderstood. Your claim about the Bible being a book for creating atheists is malicious. You know it’s not true. You became an atheist by your choice… so stop blaming it on the Bible.

Conclusions

I don’t know what everyone else think. But in my own opinion, the Bible is not a book for creating atheists. So it could not have been the best book for doing so as claimed by that reader.

Anyone that chooses to become an atheist, does so out of his or her own volition. So it will be wrong to blame it on the Bible.

The Bible is a book about God and His people. It tells the story of man from creation till when the world will end and beyond. It is a book for conviction, instruction, correction in righteousness and it prepares us for good works.

The Bible serves to bring us closer to God; not to take us away from Him. To that effect, anyone who claims to have read the Bible back to back without discovering God in it has either read a different Bible or has read it with the wrong mindset.

What do you think say?

131 thoughts on “Is The Bible Creating Atheists?

  1. spawneedave 14/09/2019 / 8:24 pm

    Characters in a work of fiction could have “anger issues”, but it doesn’t make them magically come to be real people. The god of the Bible has anger issues, Rambo also has anger issues, but by stating that, does it make either of them real?

    God killed around 2,400,000 people (according to the bible), Satan only kills 10. It appears that god has a great PR team, turning this genocidal deity into an “all loving god”. Poor Satan must have no PR, or should fire his/her team.

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    • VictorsCorner 14/09/2019 / 9:49 pm

      God is fiction only in the imagination of people like you. We know He is real. And He is a loving God.

      Yes, God can be angry. But His anger expresses His Justice.

      Just as those who denied Him in the past saw His righteous judgement, anyone who denies Him now will also come to face the same. It is inescapable.

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      • John Arthur 15/09/2019 / 4:43 am

        So how did God’s anger support God’s justice when he commanded the extermination of Canaanite and Amalekite babies? What could these babies have done that it could justify their murder?

        Liked by 1 person

        • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:38 pm

          They were corrupted people and so God wiped them out. I’m sure you know that’s not the onky time God did that, as recorded in the Bible.

          For instance, when the people of the whole world became corrupted, God destroyed them with flood saving only the family of Noah who believed in Him. Remember the story of Sodom and Gomorrah too?

          You see, that’s the same way God will judge the corruption you see in the world today. Very soon true believers in Jesus Christ will be divinely evacuated from the earth and the world will once again face the wrath of God.

          Don’t say no one warned you because that’s what I’m doing here now.

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          • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:06 am

            How were little babies corrupted? Only in your imagination!

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            • VictorsCorner 16/09/2019 / 11:35 pm

              I can’t help your ignorance there. Your mind is focused not to believe, no matter what you are told.

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              • John Arthur 17/09/2019 / 5:10 am

                You haven’t explained how the babies were corrupted to justify their slaughter? You’ve simply sidestepped the issue. Is this because you can’t explain how God could be just and command the slaughter of little babies?

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                • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:44 pm

                  I didn’t sidestep anything. You don’t know God so you would not understand His ways and actions.

                  The fact that a judge is just doesn’t mean he shouldn’t sentence criminals to jail. So the fact that God is just doesnt mean he shouldn’t destroy those who have become irredeemably corrupted in their nature.

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                  • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:09 am

                    If God exists, then God is a just judge. Yes, criminals need to be locked up, pay for their crimes and rehabilitated, so that they can re-enter society without re-offending.

                    But, explain to me how little babies can be criminals? You haven’t explained how little babies can become “… irredeemably corrupted in their nature” so that they deserve to be exterminated, have you?

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                    • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 7:48 pm

                      Please refer to my earlier comment on divine Justice.

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          • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:09 am

            The events of the conquest of Canaan and the slaughter of the Amalekites were about 400 years apart, if they occurred historically. So this killing of little children and babies was not a one-off event, as you allege.

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            • VictorsCorner 16/09/2019 / 11:39 pm

              You didn’t read my earlier comments. God’s judgement took place in many places in the Bible. The nations you cited are one out of many.

              But then God’s love is also spattered on the pages of the he Bible. Choose what you like.

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              • John Arthur 17/09/2019 / 5:23 am

                Again, you sidestep the issue. You claimed that the destruction of whole people’s was only recorded in the bible once. I show you that it was more than once.

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                • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:50 pm

                  May be that was a slip on my part. I will cross check what I wrote. I’m any case, accept my apologies.

                  What I meant is that destruction of people happened more than once in the Bible. I know my Bible at least that much.

                  That’s why I pointed out earlier that the fact that those records were not obliterated from the Bible lends more credence to the authenticity of the Bible as having been divinely inspired.

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                  • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:12 am

                    Well, just how does it lend credence to the bible as being divinely inspired. Please explain.

                    Liked by 1 person

                    • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 7:49 pm

                      There are no pretences in the Bible. The records in it are brutally truthful.

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          • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:11 am

            Most biblical scholars and historians do not believe that these events were historical. They were myths invented by the Israeli power elite to justify their barbarism to their populace.

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            • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:13 pm

              It’s funny what you believe, yet you don’t have faith to believe God exists. Good luck to you.

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          • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:12 am

            These stories, whether historical or mythological, are plainly immoral.

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            • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:16 pm

              They were certainly not mythological. But they were recorded to show example to us. That’s why we need Jesus Christ who died for us so we can have a new heart.

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              • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:17 am

                But whether stories are to be interpreted literally and/or historically or treated as myths, can’t they still be examples, except that the slaughter of little children and babies is so immoral that these stories should not be used as examples. Otherwise you will have modern genocides committed by Christians. This would not be following the example of the Jesus of the gospels, would it?

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                • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 7:56 pm

                  Sure the stories in the Bible literal and historical but never mythological.

                  You are in no position to accuse God of genocide. First you don’t believe He exists. Second, He has power to give life and to take lives. And clay cannot question the potter.

                  With your question on the example of Jesus of the Gospels, are you now reckoning with what Jesus represents? If yes, then you are gradually beginning to grasp my drift on the dispensation of Grace as earlier espoused to you.

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                  • John Arthur 19/09/2019 / 3:09 am

                    I don’t think that I accuses God of genocide, only the alleged commands of God by the Israeli power elite to justify their actions as genocide. A God of compassion, healing-mercy and loving-kindness would never command genocide. He’s not immoral but the savages who said that God commanded them to do it were creating a god in their own likeness. Jesus never promoted genocide, unlike the barbarians who wrote much of the OT

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                    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:39 am

                      I think you stand to be pitied at this point. Why do you mix up things so much?

                      You are so mistaken repeating that the OT was written by savage barbarians. I chose to believe that “prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.”

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          • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:15 am

            What wrath of God are you referring to after ‘the church is divinely evacuated’. Is this another of your fanciful myths?

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            • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:22 pm

              This is no fanciful myth. It is prophecy given in advance.

              There is going to be a time in future when those who believe in God through Jesus Christ will be supernaturally removed from this earth. It is called rapture, a kind of divine flight.

              After that will follow a series of judgement on the people that would be left in the world then. the Bible says it’s going to be a terrible time. It is the beginning of more terrible time for any and everyone who rejects the eternal salvation that is available only in Jesus Christ.

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              • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:23 am

                The rapture is mentioned by Paul in 1 Thess.4:14-17. But Jesus second coming is mentioned many times. The Gospel according to Matthew places it “immediately after the tribulation of those days…” (Mat. 24:29-31). Some biblical scholars think that this tribulation refers to the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans in CE70. Others think that it has not yet happened. Still others think that it will never happen.

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                • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 7:58 pm

                  The rapture has not happened. Once it does, we the believers in Christ will no longer be here. We would have left this world for you to begin to face the consequences of your rejecting God.

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      • spawneedave 15/09/2019 / 8:14 am

        God’s anger is justifiable? He killed every man, woman, child, infant and unborn babies, except for 8 members of the same family (which allegedly we are all descendants of). Is that justifiable? That is a loving god?

        I’d like to think if I had the powers of a god (although I prefer Mbombo, way cooler than Yahweh), and the life I created had a fault, I’d use my magic to correct the fault without having to commit genocide, infanticide, and ecocide.

        Satan is ethically a way cooler dude than that Yahweh dude.

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        • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:44 pm

          Your narrative is laughable and I dare say it’s born out of collosal ignorance.
          How could you choose satan over God? Even Satan is laughing at you right now because of that.

          You don’t even believe in God, so what would you know about His righteous judgement?

          Anyway, God is a loving God. The fact that He sent Jesus Christ to die for our sins is proof enough.

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          • spawneedave 15/09/2019 / 4:57 pm

            I was brought up as a Christian. So ignorance, no. Ethically speaking god is more evil as he/she/it does kill at a ratio of about 1:500,000 compared to Satan.

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            • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 7:54 pm

              That’s where you got it wrong. You can’t be brought up as a Christian. You become one by your own free will, through faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and personal Saviour. If you never did that, I’m afraid what you had was religion. And religion doesn’t save anyone.

              If you don’t believe God exists, there is no use you calling Him evil. That’s self-contradiction.

              If you would first agree that God exists, then we can have meaningful conversation on His nature/attributes which is obvious you have misunderstood.

              Liked by 1 person

          • spawneedave 15/09/2019 / 5:06 pm

            I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree

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  2. clubschadenfreude 14/09/2019 / 9:44 pm

    “If you believe that God has an anger issue, it means you are admitting that He exists in the first place.” VC still can’t figure out that one can speak about fictional characters just like people can talk about real ones. Darth Vader is evil. Darth Vader doesn’t exist.

    “has read it with the wrong mindset.” aka VC is sure that if you don’t agree with him, you have to be wrong. He can’t show this to be true, but he sure is convinced of it.

    “If we have to speak of a single purpose of the Bible, it would be to reveal God to us. There are many things that we could never know about God unless He told them to us. The Bible is God’s self-revelation to humanity. The Bible also tells us who we are. It tells us of our sin and of God’s plan of salvation in Jesus Christ.”

    So, VC, how many people have you killed who were working on the “sabbath”? Your bible tells you to do so and your supposed savior concurs with that commandment.

    Liked by 1 person

    • VictorsCorner 14/09/2019 / 9:54 pm

      You talk like this because you don’t understand the scriptures neither do you know the power of God. Under the new testament, we do not kill people because of Sabbath. This is a time of grace.

      Under grace, what mattera if you accept Jesus or not. It is no longer about Sabbath or any of those laws.

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      • clubschadenfreude 15/09/2019 / 1:31 am

        So, show the power of your version of the Christian god, VC. Just like every Christian, you make up an excuse why you don’t have to follow the inconvenient laws of the OT. There is nothing in the bible about a “time of grace”.

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        • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:06 pm

          We are in era of grace now. That’s why you have the audacity to insult God and get away with it. But the time of grace is to enable you have a change of heart about God.

          You can have the change of heart by giving your life to God through Jesus Christ while you are still alive. Without that, there is no way you will escape the coming judgement of God.

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          • clubschadenfreude 15/09/2019 / 5:36 pm

            ah, and again VC can’t show that his bible mentions an “era of grace” at all. It’s just something Christians like him have made up to excuse the failure of their god.

            And more baseless threats. VC will go to his grave knowing that his claims were false. What happens in another 1000 years and still your god a no-show?

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            • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 8:10 pm

              It’s a pity you failed to grasp my point. Oray be you are deliberately ignoring the substance of the discourse.

              For emphasis sake, know that the era of grace began when Jesus Christ died on the cross for you and I and everyone else in the world for the remission of our sins and to bring us into a relationship with God.

              The difference between you and I is that I have accepted by faith this grace that was extended to me by the death of Christ. But you have deliberately refused to do so.

              I’m not threatening you. Just warning you of the impending danger of your deliberate choice to hate anything called God. The only to escape it is to give your life to Jesus Christ now.

              I will go to my grave knowing that I have shared the truth with you and you would not say no one warned you ahead of time.

              I will go to the grave knowing that by accepting Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior, I have secured my eternal destiny with God. But you will be left to face the consequences of rejecting God, which is eternal damnation where Satan your father will be waiting for you.

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              • clubschadenfreude 15/09/2019 / 9:49 pm

                There is no “era of grace”. You have made it up. Jesus Christ never existed or died on the cross. and per the bible story, this character died because this god was either too stupid or intentionally allowed Satan into the garden.

                You have accepted this nonsense because you were raised in it and then made it in your image. It’s a very heady thing to be told, that some magical being agrees with you and cares for you. Like every other theist, you accept nonsense by “faith”. Your claims are just as ridiculous as any other theist’s.

                You are threatening me since you have no evidence of your god or this “impending danger”. You try to claim a danger and have none to show.

                As I’ve said before, hard to hate the imaginary. I do hate Christians who lie, like you do, VC.

                I’ve read the bible and its lunatic prophecies. I’ve been warned by a book that claims that stars can fall on the earth (they are vastly larger), that claims that this god intentionally forces humans to work with Satan, and that claims that this god “must” release its supposed archenemy to corrupt Christians, since Jesus Christ killed everyone else.

                Heck, VC, if you want to claim all that nonsense is real, go ahead. It makes your god look less than sane.

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                • VictorsCorner 16/09/2019 / 1:12 am

                  Now I know that your ignorance is without bounds. How could you say Jesus never existed or died on the cross? You don’t even know what you are talking about.

                  If telling you that rejecting Jesus Christ has consequences is a threat to you, so be it. I have no apologies for that.

                  You either believe in God or you die in your atheism. The choice is yours and so is the consequence.

                  In any case,. God is ready for you when you are. Acknowledge Him and save yourself from the misery and hopelessness that atheism represents.

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                  • clubschadenfreude 16/09/2019 / 2:56 am

                    How could I say that? Since there is no evidence VC. But you are welcome to show evidence. You have some, right?

                    You lie about consequences, VC. Still no evidence for your god, and funny how this god does absolutely nothing to anyone, showing that the bible is just a sequence of stories of a god that supposedly did something but now has vanished. Just like any god from the bronze/iron ages. This god doesn’t smite priests and pastors who harm kids, this god doesn’t do anything about atheists and non-christians who say it’s a imaginary bit of nonsense, etc.

                    Yep, I’ll die in my atheism, having enjoyed a life that isn’t requiring me to worship a bratty god that doesn’t exist.

                    As for hopelessness, again VC fails. I have plenty of hope in humanity. I have just ridicule for adults who worship a magical best friend.

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                    • VictorsCorner 16/09/2019 / 11:34 pm

                      It must really be so so confusing to be an atheist. You would never have a straight thought line.

                      First God doesn’t exist. Later he exists as monster who kills babies. Here now He used to do something but has now varnished. What a laughable belief system you have.

                      My dear, seek God with all your heart and you will find Him. Away with your meaning less lines of thought.

                      You know you are deceiving yourself by the things you say here. But really you are wasting nmy valuable time.

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                    • clubschadenfreude 17/09/2019 / 4:24 pm

                      Well, VC, you are still doing the baseless claims and bearing false witness. Good toknow.

                      For someone who tries to claim others don’t understand, we have you intentionally trying to claim that I don’t believe in god and then I do. Again, VC, you intentionally lie, to try to quote mine me. I don’t believe in god, but I can still criticize god. But thanks for showing that again, you don’t care what your bible says if it inconveniences you.

                      And funny how “valuable” your time gets when you are failing. 😀

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                    • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:59 pm

                      You know I’m not failing here. You are simply being mischievous. And I understand your game.

                      If you truly don’t believe in God why bother with all the diatribes here? Or is your time not valuable to you?

                      I feel that somehow your heart is judging you that your atheism doesn’t stand on a strong foundation. You have a hollow in your heart that only God can fill. But of course you wouldn’t admit that. Yet you come here disputing what you don’t understand and don’t even care to understand.

                      My point is, if you truly believe there is no God, move on. But if there is God (and I believe there is), you cannot escape His judgement.

                      It is my duty to warn you about that. Otherwise, what makes you think I could not have gotten rid of you here by blocking you from further commenting on this blog?

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                    • clubschadenfreude 18/09/2019 / 6:26 pm

                      More wishful thinking by VC since he can’t comprehend anyone dare disagreeing with him. Alas for you, VC, I do understand you and your religion quite well.

                      Again, VC, I am here to counter your false and baseless claims. Doing that is valuable to me. But do keep trying so very hard to convince me that I should be sitting down and shutting up.

                      Well, your feelings are telling you wrong, and only what VC wants to hear. Block me any time, VC. That won’t make me agree with you or make your nonsense true. It will go a long way in showing you have nothing.

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                    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:32 am

                      You have nothing to offer. Your atheism has blinded you to the truth of the Gospel we share here.

                      I have nothing to prove to you. You don’t believe in God why I should count on you to believe in what I say here?

                      You can either continue in the darkness and hopelessness of your atheism or simple accept the light of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. You are lost forever with out it.

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                    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 7:41 am

                      What I tell you here is not wishfull-thinking as you alleged. The Bible, the word of God is my authority. Unlike you, you build a castle on the sandy foundation of atheism. Yet you don’t realise how foolish that is.

                      I am not blocking you here, contrary to your expctation. But that does’t give you the right to come here and make unguided statements on my blog.

                      It’s a free world, I know. So feel free to disgree with my views but don’t harshly criticise what you don’t understand, bescause clearly you don’t know God and you don’t believe in His power.

                      You can deny it, but the reason you continue with ending online triables on the notion of God is because your conscience pricks you so much. Its voice in your heart tells you there God but you do everything you can to suppress it. But you are doing so at your own risk.

                      Stop trying to shut down Christians. You will fail woefully, just ike many before you have.

                      If you don’t have a enough sense to believe that God exists, then stop calling yourself wise, because obviously you have believed a lie. And only the truth of the gospel of Jesus Christ can set you free. The earlier you realise that, the better for you.

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  3. John Arthur 15/09/2019 / 3:39 am

    ” Samuel said to Saul, ‘Yahweh sent me to anoint you king over his people, Israel: now therefore listen to the words of Yahweh. Thus says Yahweh of hosts, ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did in opposing the Israelites when they came up out of Egypt. Now go and attack Amalek and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them but kill both man and woman. child and infant, ox and sheep. camel and donkey.’ ” (1 Sam.15:1-3).

    This passage is part of “all scripture” that the author of 2 Timothy is referring to. How is this profitable? It’s a command to commit genocide; to murder little children and babies. It is totally immoral and you should be ashamed if you think that the God of Jesus Christ inspired it.

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    • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:15 pm

      I think you are missing the point. There is nothing to be ashamed about here. Rather it lends credence to the authenticity of the Bible as a complete record…

      A genuine biography should show both the good, the bad and ugly about a person. That’s what the Bible shows about the Israelites and the dealings of God with them.

      As for the Amelekites, they got God’s judgement, your calling it genocide notwithstanding.

      For your information, the same way God judged the Amalekites will be the same way He would judge all those that reject Jesus Christ and anything called God. And except you repent, even you cannot escape that coming judgement.

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      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:18 am

        Didn’t you know that Jesus promised to come again during the lifetime of his disciples, but it failed to happen? So there is no coming judgment!

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        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:26 pm

          No, Jesus never promised He would come again in the lifetime of His disciples. But it was an ongoing expectations.

          Jesus said no one knew when He would come again. We are to remain expectant.

          Of course there is a coming judgement. Anyone and everyone who rejects the salvation in Christ Jesus will be judged. There is no escape.

          Liked by 1 person

          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:38 am

            Read Matthew ch.10 and especially Vs. 16-23.

            In particular verse 23 says “When they persecute you in one town, flee to the next; for truly I tell you, you will not have gone through all the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.”The “you” refers to the twelve disciples as the context clearly shows. These 12 disciples have all died long ago. The phrase ;the Son of Man” refers to Jesus as the final judge. (See Dan.7:13-14), hence is a reference to Jesus coming in the clouds of heaven. But Jesus failed to come again, as he promised.

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:05 pm

              Stop feigning understanding of the scriptures. You don’t believe so you don’t understand.

              Jesus has not failed to come. A better way to put it is that He has not come yet but He will surely come. Just after His Ascension, two angels spoke the following words to the disciples who saw Him taken up in the clouds:

              …Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
              Acts 1:11 KJV
              https://bible.com/bible/1/act.1.11.KJV

              When Jesus comes back, the whole world will know it.

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              • John Arthur 19/09/2019 / 4:15 am

                What do you mean that I don’t understand the bible? Don’t you mean that you don’t understand because you are not born of the breath? Jesus said that unless you are born of the breath you cannot enter the kingdom of God. You need to practice breath meditation. Then the presence of peace and compassion would surround you and you would realise the total immorality of slaughtering babies.

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                • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:44 am

                  Please stop misquoting Jesus. This is what He said:

                  Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
                  John 3:5 KJV
                  https://bible.com/bible/1/jhn.3.5.KJV

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                  • John Arthur 19/09/2019 / 6:31 am

                    I didn’t misquote Jesus. The Greek word for spirit used in John 3:5 is pneuma. The Greek word means breath.

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                    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 7:02 am

                      In the context that Jesus used the word, it means ‘spirit’ not ‘breath’. Being born again which was the topic Jesus was expatiating on means to be born by the Spirit (a spiritual birth), not to be born by the wind (wind birth?)

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:41 am

            Jesus said that no one knows the day nor the hour when he would return, but only the Father knows. This just means that he did not predict an exact date, but he did say that it would be within the lifetime of his disciples.

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:09 pm

              You are right in the first part: no one knows when Jesus will come. But your assertion that He would come in the days of the disciples is incorrect.

              It was a possibility but it didn’t happen and it hasn’t happened yet. But surely He will come one day.

              Dead or alive, I’m ready for Him. Only people like you who are not prepared for His appearing will gnash your teeth in regrets. But you still stand a chance to escape hell if you will give your life to Jesus now.

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  4. John Arthur 15/09/2019 / 4:11 am

    1 Sam.ch.15 is one of the numerous chapters in the bible where God is portrayed as very violent and commands the slaughter of people. Of course, the people who wrote much of the OT were themselves very violent, ignorant and barbaric savages who creates their god in their own likeness. No wonder reading such passages creates atheists. These savages had an anger management problem which they projected onto their god.

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    • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:18 pm

      The things you read and refer to here are enough testimonies against you. So you are inexcusable.

      God is love but He is also fearsome. If you don’t accept His love now, you will inevitably face His fearsome judgement.

      Like

        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:34 pm

          I don’t have a religion. So it can’t even be based on fear.

          What I have is a relationship with God based on love. God loves me and I love Him too. I follow Him out of my own free will, not by force and certainly not by fear.

          The coming judgment is against those who refuse to believe in God.

          It would be foolish to think that you would spurn God all through your life time and not face the consequences. As the Bibles says, ” …it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.”

          If you don’t give your life to Jesus, you can’t escape that coming judgment. You must prepare to your God.

          Like

          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 2:45 am

            You do have a religion. It’s called Christianity. Don’t you claim to follow Jesus? Don’t you attend a church? Don’t you follow a specific set of doctrines and practices that your church teaches? You may claim a relationship, but this is not inconsistent with having a religion, is it?

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:14 pm

              I have a relationship with God through Jesus Christ. That’s what matters to me more than being called a Christian. The name itself is not bad, but it has been misused or misunderstood.

              What Jesus offers is a relationship with God by faith, not some religious practices.

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:10 am

            Isn’t the understanding of the gospel proclaimed by many Evangelical and Fundamentalist churches a gospel of “fire insurance”. Hence it is based on fear. And isn’t it true that many members of such churches who claim to be ‘born again” are afraid of dying because they think that God might reject them. This is a message of fear. Isn’t love meant to cast out fear? It seems many Fundamentalists don’t have assurance of salvation. Why is that? Isn’t it due to the wrong headed idea that God is a God of fearsome wrath?

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:19 pm

              I don’t know what you mean by Gospel of fire insurance. What we have is a Gospel of peace and love.

              Our relationship with God is one of love, hope and faith. Not fear in the sense you put it.

              Yes God is a God of love. But yes He is also a fearsome God. People like you who don’t accept His love now will face His wrath in due season. You cannot escape it, except you repent.

              Like

      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:23 am

        Hey VC,

        Your ignorance of what the bible actually says is astounding. Jesus didn’t come back again during the lifetime of his Jewish apostles, as he promised.

        Like

        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:37 pm

          You are the one who has misunderstood the Bible. Jesus never promised to come at a specific date. He promised to come back again but He never said ‘when’. Please missing things up.

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:12 am

            I never said that Jesus promised to come back again at a specific date, but he did promise that it would be during the lifetime of his 12 apostles.

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:20 pm

              No you are getting it wrong. Like I said already, it was a possibility that could have happened, but it didn’t and has not up till now. But He will come one day.

              Like

  5. John Arthur 15/09/2019 / 4:17 am

    If these violent passages are inspired by God, then isn’t Jesus mistaken when he told his disciples to love their enemies and to be kind to little children. He didn’t tell his people to kill little children and babies. He commanded his disciples to love their enemies, not to kill them. He commanded his disciples to be compassionate like their heavenly Father is compassionate because he is kind to the ungrateful and the wicked. So if Jesus is correct, then the violent passages of the OT are wrong. If the violent passages of the OT are correct, then Jesus is wrong.

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    • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:29 pm

      Neither Jesus Christ that said we should love our enemies, nor the OT that have some violent passages (as you put it) is wrong. It is a question of time and dispensation.

      The stories you read in OT are actual events that were recorded. The writers were inspired to keep all the stories as unpalatable as some of them were, otherwise they might have removed the unsavoury part. But that’s by the way.

      Jesus brought down the love of God to the world literally, so He was right in saying we should love our enemies. That way we would show that we belong to God.

      But why do you care? Do you now believe in God? I think the first thing you should do is to consider giving your life to Jesus Christ. Every other thing is secondary.

      Without a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ, you are doomed forever.

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      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:27 am

        So according to you contradictory stories can both be true, because they are in different dispensations. So much for the inspiration of the bible since, if God inspires contradictions, then we cannot know whether any of it is true, can we?

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 6:12 am

          There is no contradictions. Your atheist mindset is limiting your understanding.

          Like

      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:38 am

        Aren’t you making this idea of different dispensations up?

        Liked by 1 person

        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:10 pm

          I am not making it up. The Bible makes it very clear…

          People that lived under the Old Testament were under the dispensation of the Law. But from when Jesus Christ died and resurrected (the New Testament), we were ushered into the dispensation of Grace.

          And that continues till now. But be assured, it will not be forever.

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:19 am

            But grace is in the OT and law is in the NT. Doesn’t the mythical story of the Exodus show us that Israel was redeemed by grace before the giving of the law at Sinai?

            And isn’t it true that the NT speaks about the “law of Christ”? And doesn’t love (compassion, healing-mercy and loving-kindness) fulfil (fill to the full) the true meaning of the law?

            These are NOT different dispensations but relate to different covenants. There is grace in both testaments and there is law in both testaments but grace triumphs over judgments. Mercy triumphs over wrath. God’s wrath is but for a season. His mercy endures forever.

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:27 pm

              There was grace in the OT but it was the exception rather than the norm. In NT, grace is the norm. So please stop trying to explain what you don’t believe or understand for that matter.

              The records in the Exodus are actually historical events, never mythical as you suggested.

              True, mercy supercedes judgement. But a time will come when there will be no more mercy. Then divine judgement will be inevitable.

              Now is your time of mercy. Jesus is knocking at your heart. Will you let Him in?

              Like

  6. John Arthur 15/09/2019 / 12:50 pm

    How could a God of compassion, healing-mercy and loving-kindness, if he exists, have inspired ancient savages to exterminate whole populations? The God of the bible is a moral monster who doesn’t exist. Aren’t you being delusional to believe in his existence?

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    • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 4:50 pm

      I’m not being delusion for believing that God exists. Truth be told, you and your likes are the delusional ones for believing that God doesn’t exist. It is clearly written in the Bible that only fools say God doesn’t exist.

      Yes, God is “God of compassion, healing-mercy and living-kindnes” and He exists – whether you believe it or not. But He is also a God of judgement. He will one day judge people like you who have deliberately refused to acknowledge Him.

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      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:30 am

        If God exists, then wouldn’t he want we atheists to demolish the ridiculous arguments that many of his followers put forward for his existence?

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        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 7:59 pm

          God exists and He is having fun laughing at your foolishness. Yes, atheism is foolishness, because the Bible says only fools say God doesn’t exist.

          Your argument is already demolished. And God does not have to prove Himself to you, since you have chosen to harden your heart towards Him.

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:22 am

            It says that the “fool says in his heart, “There is no God”. It doesn’t say that the person who says that there is no God is a fool.

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            • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 8:29 pm

              You make me laugh by your silly comment. Don’t you know that out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks?

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      • John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 4:33 am

        If God is a God of compassion, healing-mercy and loving-kindness he wouldn’t punish people in hell forever with infinite punishment for finite sins committed in finite time by finite people. Doesn’t it make God out to be unjust?

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        • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:06 pm

          God is not unjust. But He is a God of Justice.

          His love and grace are available for you right now. In Jesus Christ, He has made a away for you to escape the punishment of hell fire. So give your life to Jesus Christ, and hell will become a non issue for you.

          If you chose to ignore this provision and you end up in hell, it will be your foolishness that has taken you there, not because God is unjust.

          Hell was meant to punish Satan for his rebellion against God, but if you choose to rebel against God, you will also end up where satan himself will end up. And for that, you would have no one to blame but yourself.

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          • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:29 am

            Who says that I’m rebelling against God? What I am rebelling against are ridiculous concepts of God. God, if God exists is a personal, relational and social being whose nature is unconditional, others-centred, self-giving, community-forming and life-affirming compassion, healing-mercy and loving-kindness. All God’s classical attributes need to be re-interpreted in the light of God’s nature.

            We should not impose on God a violent nature, a wrathful nature. We become like the God we believe in. You need to see that God, if God exists, is love. That means that so far as all the gods known to human beings, including the Fundamentalist god that they do NOT exist.

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  7. thanksbetogod 15/09/2019 / 5:07 pm

    Unfortunately the Bible reinforces the worldview to hate what you do not understand. But that is a worldview, not a Christian view. Thank you VC for your inspired words.

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    • VictorsCorner 15/09/2019 / 7:57 pm

      Thanks for reading and commenting.

      We are people of faith. We know and perceive what the world cannot.

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      • thanksbetogod 15/09/2019 / 9:30 pm

        Sometimes the best we can do is pray for them. Glory to God for your hard work though! Arguing for Him is a gift and you have it sir!

        Liked by 1 person

        • VictorsCorner 16/09/2019 / 1:02 am

          Thanks for the warm comment. We will try our best, even when they refuse to listen to us.

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          • thanksbetogod 16/09/2019 / 4:20 am

            Refusal is only more proof of our last days but the comfort to us who believe within the context of 2 Timothy 3! God Bless!

            Liked by 1 person

    • Archon's Den 16/09/2019 / 10:07 am

      And the No True Scotsman argument is alive and well. Sidestep, evade, avoid. 🙄

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      • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:11 pm

        What part of my explanation don’t you understand please?

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        • Archon's Den 17/09/2019 / 9:54 pm

          Oh, I understood it all, including the parts that I commented about, where you change the definitions, and move the goalposts, to suit your beliefs. It’s just that I don’t believe a desperate, insecure word of it.
          If someone doesn’t agree with you exactly, then they aren’t a Christian, or they aren’t a Good Christian, or they aren’t a “Real Christian.” Atheists, of course, are evil, simply because they’re atheist.
          I’ve had this “explained” by better apologists than you and, other than Faith and blind belief in their opinions and descriptions, I’ve never been offered an argument that is even vaguely possible, much less convincing. 😯

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          • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 10:58 pm

            It doesn’t seem like you understood much of what I discussed. Otherwise, some of your comments here would have been unnecessary.

            I am not changing any definition as you alleged. May be you are mixing things up to suit your deceitful agenda. But I can see through you: You believe what you want to believe; every other thing I say you turn a deaf ear to them.

            May be ‘believe’ is not even a word I can use for you. It’s way beyond your comprehension. Poor you!

            For the records, I lay no claim to being a very good apologist. Far from it. I’m not here for a popularity contest. So your unsolicited comparison doesn’t mean much to me.

            What I try to share with you is the Gospel of Jesus Christ as I understand it. If that doesn’t impress your atheist mind, please move on. But that’s not to say that I do not appreciate your reading and commenting on my post.

            In any case, no one can force you to accept that God exists. If God Himself doesn’t false anyone to accept Him, why should I do so?

            But it is my wish that you will come to discover God yourself one day. When that day comes, you will remember people like us who have put in a word here and there. So may you find what you are looking for.

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  8. John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 11:11 am

    2 Tim.3:15-17 is part of the bible. This letter claims to have been written by Paul. But did you know that most biblical scholars believe that only 7 of the 13 letters that claim to be written by Paul were likely to have been written by him. 6 of the letters are thought to be pseudonymous. They were written, not by Paul, but later by someone claiming to be Paul.

    Liked by 1 person

    • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:20 pm

      There is no doubt that both the first and second book of Timothy were written by Paul himself. Any kindergarten christian would know that much. So perish the spurious claim you attributed to some nameless Bible scholars.

      If you are still in doubt on who wrote the books of Timothy, see how the author of the books identified himself and the person he was writing to:

      “Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus, To Timothy, my dearly beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.”
      2 Timothy 1:1‭-‬2 KJV in
      https://bible.com/bible/1/2ti.1.1-2.KJV

      Like

      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:44 am

        Well the Harper Collins Study Bible (an annotated edition by the American Society for Biblical Literature) says this of 1 and 2 Timothy as well as Titus. “The letters purport to be from Paul, but several feature seem incompatible with that claim. Their vocabulary and style differ in many ways with the rest of the Pauline letters.” (p.2229). “Like the author, the addressees are pseudonymous.” (P.2230).

        Most biblical scholars do NOT believe that the pastorals were written by Paul. And Biblical scholar, Bart Ehrman says that pseudonymity is forgery. See his book by the title “Forged”.

        Why charge these scholars (who know a lot more than you or I) with being ‘kindergarten’ Christians?

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        • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 11:17 pm

          In case you missed it the first time, let me repeat what I said before: Even a kindergarten christian knows that the books of Timothy in the Bible were written by Paul. The introduction of those letters clearly states that fact, as I earlier pointed out to you.

          Any one who thinks otherwise, whether they claim to be Bible scholars or not, is referring to another book of Timothy, not the one we are acquainted with in the Bible.

          “Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ, which is our hope; Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith: Grace, mercy, and peace, from God our Father and Jesus Christ our Lord.”
          1 Timothy 1:1‭-‬2 KJV
          https://bible.com/bible/1/1ti.1.1-2.KJV

          I do not wish to overflog this point. You can deny it but I guess you got message.

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          • John Arthur 19/09/2019 / 3:38 am

            They are refering to the letters to Timothy in the bible, not any non canonical letter.

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  9. John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 11:15 am

    Biblical scholar, Bart Ehrman, maintains that these pseudonymous letters are forgeries. So didn’t God “inspire” forgeries? The letters to Timothy are forgeries, not written by Paul but by someone claiming to be Paul. Isn’t your bible the words of men and not the words of any god?

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    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 6:11 am

      The books of Timothy just like other books of the Bible are inspired word of God. They are neither forgeries nor pseudonymous letters. Anyone who thinks they are is seriously mistaken.

      Like

  10. John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 11:19 am

    So if this NT letter that claims that all scripture is inspired of God is a forgery and therefore based on lies, aren’t you basing your so-called eternal destiny on lies?

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    • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:22 pm

      There is no forgery in the Bible. The Bible is what it claims to be: the inspired word of God.

      Like

      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:48 am

        Maybe, the bible is not the inspired Word of God? Where does the bible claim that it is the Word of God? Doesn’t it claim the Jesus is the Word of God (Jn:1:1 and !:18)? Jesus is NOT the bible, is he?

        Liked by 1 person

        • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 11:22 pm

          The Bible is the inspired word of God. By that I mean what is written in it.

          Even if you choose not to call it the Bible, or just the Book as some people call it, it doesn’t stop it from being the inspired word of God.

          Jesus is the word of God personified. I know you can’t wrap your peanut atheist brain around it. Just move on.

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      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:54 am

        Didn’t Jesus tell his disciples that all the scriptures bear witness to him? (Luke 24:25-27). Thus the scripture are a witness to the Word of God, not the Word of God. They are a fallible human witness to the Word of God, but nevertheless they do bear testimony to Jesus.

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        • VictorsCorner 18/09/2019 / 11:33 pm

          May be you should crosscheck the Bible verses before you begin to quote them here. The reference you used says something different from the one you are peddling.

          Were you referring to John 5:39 where Jesus stated that the scriptures bear witness of Him? In Jesus words, “You search the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. But the Scriptures point to me!”

          Please the last sentence again. All scriptures point to Jesus.

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      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 3:59 am

        Prove that there are no pseudonymous authors in the bible. Most biblical scholars think that there are. Show that pseudonymity and forgery are not necessarily the same.That is, show that Bart Ehrman is mistaken and the and that these pseudonymous books don’t contain lies.

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:15 am

          The books of the Bible have real, known authors. Those who say it has pseudonymous authors are seriously mistaken, I don’t care if they go by the name Bible scholars or not.

          And to say there is forgery in the Bible is arrant nonsense.

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 7:44 am

          Yes Bart Ehrman is mistaken if he truly said that the Bible was written by pseudonymous authors. We know better than that.

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  11. John Arthur 16/09/2019 / 11:26 am

    Didn’t you know that Peter’s letters are also forgeries? With so many forgeries in the NT, how can relying on different dispensations help you avoid the contradictions that are in the bible?. Barbaric savages wrote much of the OT and much of the NT is based on lies. It’s no wonder that many people who actually read the bible closely stop being Christians and become atheists. The bible is the best book for creating atheists.

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    • thanksbetogod 16/09/2019 / 6:24 pm

      Thank you for your argument! It helps continue to validate and strengthen the bond between Christians and God through our Lord Jesus Christ! Have a blessed day!

      Liked by 1 person

    • VictorsCorner 17/09/2019 / 8:38 pm

      Peter’s letters are only a forgery in your foolish imaginations. We that have a relationship with God accept them as part of the inspired word of God. And we owe you no apologies.

      There are no contradictions in the Bible. Blame your lack of understanding for the confusion in your mind. Unfortunately, you cannot begin to understand the Bible except you first ‘know’ the One who inspired it.

      I have already explained the issue of dispensation. Kindly reread my earlier response.

      You show collosal ignorance when you say that the Bible was written by barbaric savages. I don’t even want to take you up on that. May be a little!

      For the records, the first four books of the Bible were written by Moses, one of the most educated men in the world at that time. On the other hand, Paul the Apostle wrote two-thirds of the New Testament. He himself was an acclaimed legal luminary. Hope that gives you an idea how false your claim is?

      The Bible doesn’t make anyone an atheist. Any one chooses to be an atheist became so out of his or own free will. It beats my imagination how you can’t even grasp that simple truth.

      Like

      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 4:39 am

        The Harper Collins Study Bible says of 1 Peter that the “…letter dates from between 70 and 90 CE. This date and the high quality of the Greek suggest that 1Peter is pseudonymous.” (p.2277).

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:18 am

          Please stop your deception here. The very first verse of the book of Peter identifies the author and audience of the book. Why do you ignore the obvious?

          Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
          1 Peter 1:1 KJV
          https://bible.com/bible/1/1pe.1.1.KJV

          Like

      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 4:44 am

        The Harper Collins Study bible says this of 2 Peter. ” Most scholars, …, now believe that it was written after Peter’s death.” (p.2286).

        Why charge these scholars with “foolish imaginations”?

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:21 am

          It is foolish imagination to ignore the obvious and propound your own own theories. Read the first verse of second book of Peter, the author is clearly stated:

          Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
          2 Peter 1:1 KJV
          https://bible.com/bible/1/2pe.1.1.KJV

          Like

      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 4:50 am

        The Pentateuch was NOT written by Moses. Most scholars believe in a revised version of the Graff-Wellhausen hypothesis that the Pentateuch was a compilation of various sources known as J, E, D, and P. These were compiled between the J (Yahwist) source written somewhere around 900 BCE, E (Elohist) source around 800 BCE, D, (Deuteronomist) source around 600 BCE and the P (Priestly) source after the exile.

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:25 am

          Away with your foolishness insinuations and stop making claims about some ignorant scholars.

          The first books of the Bible were written by Moses. Okay?

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      • John Arthur 18/09/2019 / 4:57 am

        Hi Victor,

        You don’t seem to know anything about the last 250 years of biblical scholarship. Maybe you should inform yourself, instead of relying on outdated pre-critical concepts of the bible.

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        • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 5:26 am

          The Bible is the best book on Earth. It has held it’s onions for centuries and it will continue to do so. I hope you learn that one day.

          Like

  12. RaPaR 19/09/2019 / 5:31 am

    As I have told many people, “If you want to become an atheist, read the Bible.” However, there is one caveat; you have to read it with your eyes open, not in little vignettes as the ministers and televangelists like to feed it to their sheep. No, it must be read in complete chapters and books. Like all religions, it just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny, it falls apart right n your hands.

    I am still so disappointed that so many seemingly “intelligent” people just can not let this nonsense go; they just can not extricate themselves from the guilt, the fear of eternal punishment, the paranoia of a “god” that portends to watch over them and know their deepest thoughts and desires. When I first began to really study the Bible, I was looking for my faith. I had been a Catholic but was certain that Catholicism was not the faith of Jesus. However, as I delved into the subject matter I began to see all the defects I had never noticed before. Then I stumbled on to the Jesus Seminar and the topic of the critical analysis of NT scripture taking place over the last 200 years. The more I read and learned, the broader my range of research expanded, the more I began to understand the specious nature of the subject matter. Eventually, it became so scholastic/intellectual an exercise that I almost missed the fact that I no longer believed in any of it as anything but an interesting intellectual pursuit.

    Be brave. Let go of the rocks and let the current carry you where it may.

    Like

    • VictorsCorner 19/09/2019 / 6:03 am

      You cannot read the Bible with an open heart and not see God splattered everywhere on its pages.

      The Bible is a book that has been under scrutiny for years and it has never failed to hold it’s onions. Never you nor a million of people like you can change that.

      Atheism has blinded you so much you don’t see your folly. But we can see through you from miles apart.

      Stop criticising what you don’t know because obviously you do not understand the Bible nor the power of God.

      One thing I know is that you are not at peace with yourself. You cannot be as along you continue to reject God. The emptiness in your heart has created a shape only God can fill.

      You did not create yourself. God did. And you are accountable to Him whether or not you reckon with God.

      Whatever you may say or think: only fools say there is no God.

      Liked by 1 person

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